point counterpoint

thrust: so what exactly does the new designation "e.l.l." refer to?

parry: it refers to "english language learners."

thrust: you mean e.s.l. students?

parry: no, we don't use that term anymore.

thrust: how come?

parry: because it has been replaced with e.l.l.

thrust: yes, but how come?

parry: because e.s.l. was thought to carry negative connotations.

thrust: thought by whom?

parry: by the board. by the ministry. by educators.

thrust: and the negative connotations?

parry: the term e.s.l. was thought to carry a stigma.

thrust: a stigma? who exactly was being stigmatized?

parry: e.l.l. students.

thrust: how were they being stigmatized?

parry: some of them were being labelled second-class students because of their second language status.

thrust: labelled second-class students? by whom?

parry: by native english speakers.

thrust: they were? how do you know?

parry: we just know.

thrust: and who exactly is now considered an e.l.l. student?

parry: um, students whose first language is not english and who are learning english while they are also learning the curriculum content.

thrust: huh?

parry: non-native speakers who are learning english at the same time they are learning the curriculum material.

thrust: you mean e.s.l. students?

parry: we don't call them that anymore.

thrust: oh, that's right. now they're called english language learners. tell me, does that term include students who are taking regular english classes in high school? you know, like a grade 10 english class?

parry: only if the student is a non-native speaker.

thrust: you mean, only if they did not learn english as a first language.

parry: yes, that's right.

thrust: so only if they learned english as, say, a second language?

parry: or a third language.

thrust: and you were saying that those students who learned english as a second, or third or fourth, language are somehow stigmatized by the rest of the school population because they speak more than one language?

parry: that's not what i said.

thrust: stigmatized for speaking multiple languages. that's a source of embarrassment for them?

parry: no, i didn't say that. i said they were being singled out.

thrust: as second language learners?

parry: as english language learners.

thrust: and a seven-year-old kid learning grammar in grade school is not an e.l.l. student?

parry: not if he is a native speaker.

thrust: or she?

parry: not if he or she is a native speaker.

thrust: ok, just so i understand. one is not necessarily an e.l.l. student just because one is learning the english language?

parry: not necessarily.

thrust: and in order to be considered an e.l.l. student, one must be learning english as a non-native speaker... learning english not as one's native tongue but as an... as an additional language.

parry: yes.

thrust: as a... second language?

parry: perhaps as a second language.

thrust: or even a third language?

parry: perhaps.

thrust: but we no longer call those folks e.s.l. students?

parry: that is correct.

thrust: because we don't want to propagate a stigma against those students?

parry: yes.

thrust: the stigma of learning english not as a first language... but rather as a second or perhaps even as a third language.

parry: yes.

thrust: because kids look down on others who speak more than one language.

parry: i didn't say that.

thrust: hey, i just had a brilliant idea. what if we called them english as an additional language students? or eals for short.

parry: now you're being silly.


"unthinking respect for authority is the greatest enemy of truth." - albert einstein